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Big taboos? - Sue (23rd Jul 2023 - 16:53:33) Two questions. What would the good people of Talkback think and do if and when: 1) Hundreds of single, young, male illegal immigrants were to be housed in limbo within the parish? 2) Net Zero would charge fines for driving within the parish? Fire away!

Re: Big taboos? - Steve (23rd Jul 2023 - 21:35:45) Not rising to the immigration bait but on a point of clarification, Ulez is not particularly related to net zero but more to improving air quality near congested roads.

Re: Big taboos? - Jen (24th Jul 2023 - 12:28:00) 1) What would I do if hundreds of single, young, male illegal immigrants were to be housed in limbo within the parish? Answer: I'm not sure. Maybe nothing. 2) What would I do if Net Zero would charge fines for driving within the parish? Answer: I would probably walk more and drive less.

Re: Big taboos? - Pete (24th Jul 2023 - 14:31:37) 1- Not a very likely scenario but if you want to prod a bear so be it. I would try to understand the hardships people must experience to consider leaving family and friends to travel hundreds if not thousands of miles to improve their lives. 2- Make sure I was at the relevant public meetings to ensure viable public transport and cycle infrastructure was in place prior to any legislation being passed.

Re: Big taboos? - local (24th Jul 2023 - 15:47:15) Not going to rise to talk about immigration either, I'm sure people have always moved for a better life and we would too if our country was failing and theirs was better than it is, but as things stand ours is better and theirs are failing, if you don't like immigration we would need to start failing more and then become refugees ourselves! We also need cheap workers so it's a win win. But regarding the hateful ULEZ, I need to drive to outer London regularly, about a hundred times a year average and don't earn enough for a new car, for my budget i'd be buying a ten year old petrol car that probably had 6 or 7 previous owners, may or may not be a shed load of trouble, certainly wouldn't be as good as my 8 year old diesel that I was told to buy literally because it's better for the environment than petrol! Transport for London are going to make billions from this tax, as we all upgrade our cars over the next few years they won't want to lose that slush fund income stream, installing all the cameras was a big outlay, even if you have a modern petrol hybrid you can be sure you'll be next, the rich will hardly be inconvenienced, it's us low paid workers struggling to get by who are going to be repeatedly stuffed by this tax, the Americans refuse to pay it, they argue you cannot tax foreign nationals, TFL claim it's not a tax, but that doesn't wash with them and I agree!

Re: Big taboos? - Steve (24th Jul 2023 - 17:28:17) I don't want to get into the politics of ulez but, browsing Autotrader this afternoon, it doesn't appear that there is a dramatic diffence in the price of second hand diesel cars either side of the changeover from Euro 5 to Euro 6. I was looking at 1.6L VW diesel golf's circa 2015 but I suspect that the same situation exists with other cars from that era. There is obviously some cost to change but it would seem to be possible to swap to a Ulez exempt model for a relatively modest amount.

Re: Big taboos? - Sarah (24th Jul 2023 - 17:54:50) Sue Please can I ask why you’re asking?

Re: Big taboos? - D (25th Jul 2023 - 12:21:38) I wonder what Sue would do with hundreds of single male illegal immigrants in the parish. The mind boggles.

Re: Big taboos? - gareth j rees (25th Jul 2023 - 12:50:07) ULEZ is a bad policy who pays the tax? people who cannot afford newer cars - and that is poorer families and the elderly - in a cost of living crisis starmer has said it's a poor call by the mayor our economic model only works if we have a steady stream of immigration and people who are willing to wait tables and clean trains etc yet you cannot have 700,000 people coming into the UK if you only build 170,000 dwellings every year it will be 15 years of the tories by the time their term is up enough already

Re: Big taboos? - passfield resident (25th Jul 2023 - 13:49:19) Gareth -your post sounds racist-immigrants don't just wait on tables and clean stuff- they contribute hugely to all areas of the economy

Re: Big taboos? - Penny Williamson (25th Jul 2023 - 14:03:29) Yes ULEZ is a bad policy brought in by a Labour Mayor. It's all very well for Starmer to say it's a poor call by the Mayor. I don't think that's going to help the people who can ill afford to pay this tax. Actions speak louder than words.

Re: Big taboos? - Salty (25th Jul 2023 - 14:16:35) Good Question ... 1) Something positive for them, we all share this planet, like it or not 2) Buy a horse

Re: Big taboos? - Steve (25th Jul 2023 - 14:43:16) Well Gareth Ulez might well be a bad policy but what would be your alternative approach to improving air quality near the congested roads of outer London? Despite its undoubted flaws Ulez phase 1 does seem to have had a marked beneficial impact on air quality.

Re: Big taboos? - local (25th Jul 2023 - 17:44:44) As the old saying goes, lies, damned lies and statistics! The problem is with the Mayor of London ordering you to do one thing, the precise opposite of what the government told you to do, so we the poorest end up with worthless vehicles we can't afford to scrap, it was bad enough to be driven out of London by house prices, now we can't even afford to visit our relatives left behind and they couldn't care less! You can't have government begging us to buy diesel cars to save the environment and when we do, Khan punishing us by demanding we scrap them for a petrol. Very few of us have dedicated off road charging points, the ranges for electrics are still woefully low, on road charging is woefully slow, hit and miss and actually more expensive than diesel now!! A bit of joined up thinking would be fairer than moving the goalposts. The EU set pretty high emissions rules already and pollution from traffic in the UK has fallen 800% since the 1970s (yes virtuous signalling youth we had many things worse even though you refuse to believe it) This tax that the Mayor needs is because he has woefully mismanaged TfL finances having had to go cap in hand to the Tory government for a 7 billion quid bailout recently to avoid bankruptcy (typical labour) they gave it to him but said no more, manage your affairs right. So he is desperate. Just look at the litany of half truths and total rubbish they based this tax on poor people on. He is desperate even as a supposed Labour big wig yet he is hitting the poorest. London air quality has never been better since Georgian times! Car and van traffic is no longer the biggest polluter, guess what, yuppy log burning stoves come in at 30% followed by lorries! Neither will be banned by the expanding ULEZ they are both exempt as are coaches and refrigerated lorries, which were recently exposed as totally unregulated engines, each responsible for 166 times the pollution of a modern lorry. They deliver your McDonalds, my car delivers me to work, it would have been fair and no biggie to have allowed us to upgrade naturally, over the next few years there would have been hardly any of these older cars left, but he would have been bankrupt by then, so he couldn't hold on even a little longer! I read about the claim 4000 people die from air pollution a year in London, apparently it has been debunked, there are no statistics kept on who dies from 'air pollution' it's not a thing, allegedly the university students who issued the study said it was theoretical and real world death should not be extrapolated into it. He forgot to mention that when he put it in his consultation document, there's more, you read it. Will be interesting to see what the judge makes of all this mess, hopefully see right through it!

Re: Big taboos? - D (25th Jul 2023 - 19:17:10) Gareth Jrees, will you be having your posts removed in the morning? Then claim you "stand by everything you said"? 😂

Re: Big taboos? - Steve (25th Jul 2023 - 19:25:25) Well they do say 'never let the facts get in the way of a good rant' You can quote as many statistics as you like but it is beyond any reasonable doubt that the air quality near busy roads in the capital is damaging the health of vulnerable people (for example suffering from asthma) who live nearby. Perhaps not many will actually die as a result but large numbers are badly affected and their quality of life is severely impacted. As I noted above, the first phase of ulez has been shown to have significantly improved air quality and be a direct benefit to people's health.

Re: Big taboos? - Simon (26th Jul 2023 - 09:10:58) I'm likely being dim, but if ULEZ is all about improving air quality and isn't about raising money, why not just ban the most polluting vehicles completely, rather than asking owners to pay to use them?

Re: Big taboos? - Penny Williamson (26th Jul 2023 - 09:48:45) Simon that is a very good point.

Re: Big taboos? - Local (26th Jul 2023 - 11:00:03) Yes of course very good, cheer cheer! I say here's another great Labour idea, why not just ban poor people while we're at it? Great but clueless or insensitive policies made on the hoof without thinking it through, ok we'll ban poor people's cars, then maybe every poor person can just magic up a new electric car from the stuttering global production line, or else remain in their village waiting for the once a week bus, good enough for them, or else pick a new electric car off the magic electric car tree like politicians do, along with a new duck house. Then of course in 3 years time we'll need to talk about banning the cars the poor people bought when they dumped their current ones, and on and on, it's their fault for being poor, should have become very rich and lived large like us! Yet still a big fat zero interest in banning wood burning stoves that emit 5 X more of the most lung destroying PM10 and PM2 pollution than all light vehicles put together, we don't talk about that kind of hypocrisy silly old local! And still the rich and not so rich will fly off to Greece to find some burning hot sun, still China and India and most of Asia and Africa, South America will build new coal power stations, buy cheap Russian oil and gas, but somehow if we could just crush local poor people's cars we might be onto something....

Re: Big taboos? - Local (26th Jul 2023 - 11:22:11) If Labour want any more good ideas from us, it's worth mentioning that the Labour Assembly are not necessarily banning the most polluting cars from London, just the oldest, many if not most of which are small, economical, loved, well looked after and perhaps most annoyingly to big business interests, very affordable. They pass all government and EU tests to be on the roads that we own and pay for and have therefore a statutory right to be using the highway. There are however many, many huge new SUV's, supercars and limousines blatantly being driven around London day and night by the rich tax avoiding classes dropping off little Lucretia at prep, delivering Charles to the Atheneum or taking Mohammed and his mates to the latest Knightsbridge cafe, that are 4,5,6 litres or more, 8 or 12 cylinder monsters, pumping out gas like it was going out of fashion, banning them would of course be a little more unpalatable since rich people don't tend to take things lying down and say 'oh well it must for the greater good or they wouldn't be doing this to me' yet we poor folk are expected to!

Re: Big taboos? - passfield resident (26th Jul 2023 - 14:25:49) Local-one small point-China lead the world at the moment in developing renewables. Too easy to blame things on other people.

Re: Big taboos? - Penny Williamson (26th Jul 2023 - 16:37:53) Local makes some valid points but the sarcasm with a healthy whiff of “victim” and “self pity” rather detracts from his/her post.

Re: Big taboos? - Salty (26th Jul 2023 - 16:54:03) What about the horse ? Gee up my Eco friend ...

Re: Big taboos? - dave (26th Jul 2023 - 17:27:37) Sue has prodded the nest and having a right old laugh now. My input, live for today and let others worry about the future and, I'm also a NIMBY and proud of it ;-)

Re: Big taboos? - D (26th Jul 2023 - 19:45:46) I think Sue is more worried about her hundreds of young single male illegal immigrants. I must say how impressed I am that no-one has fallen for the bait of that one. Take your poison elsewhere, Sue.

Re: Big taboos? - paul (26th Jul 2023 - 21:43:06) Hi, ULEZ for Central, and Greater London (not Liphook), is a good environmental idea. The current generation, and our future children's health is at stake in the Capital. Yes no one likes paying an extra charge to travel, but our long-term human health is more important.

Re: Big taboos? - Local (26th Jul 2023 - 22:13:50) Paul you say great idea to ban poor people's cars I take it won't be affecting you? Paul, 25% of the worst air pollution is wood burning stoves, banning those would therefore have more effect, cost a hell of a lot less and affect far fewer people with far less discriminatory real life consequences , can I take it you are totally behind banning them first???

Re: Big taboos? - Salty (26th Jul 2023 - 22:22:13) Yes come on Sue, what about my horse ??

Re: Big taboos? - Joe (27th Jul 2023 - 12:30:49) local the majority of wood burners are in the countryside areas not London. If you are not on mains gas ( as some of us are not) then it can be very handy to keep us warm. I would add I do not burn green wood it is at least 3 years old before I use the wood.

Re: Big taboos? - Another Local (27th Jul 2023 - 13:11:36) Local - Exactly how local are you, that is in years of residency, place of birth and current location ? You seem to me to be a closet Urbanite, ever sniffed a bonfire ?

Re: Big taboos? - gareth j rees (27th Jul 2023 - 13:24:23) ULEZ is a bad policy and the mayor is making a mistake I'm running back to work training right now in Hounslow If guys from the job centre have got a car then it is a family car and it's old The policy stops them from using it for work - that is bad in a Tory cost of living crisis Now is not the time to bring ULEZ in And when it does come in OAP's and families receiving benefit should be exempt Most refugees are low skilled That's not racist - it's a fact Very small numbers of professional people emigrate to the UK if you look at the stats And why on earth would they? And I might ask for my post to be deleted again if I'm asked to edit my posts

Re: Big taboos? - D (27th Jul 2023 - 13:41:22) Seem to be a lot of repeats on this website, I've always had a wood burner (coal in the day) because I couldn't afford central heating. "Yuppy wood burners"? Don't think so. In the meantime the aviation industry is belching out ever more pollution.

Re: Big taboos? - paul (27th Jul 2023 - 21:23:57) Hi, We are all doomed anyway. According to World Heath Organization it is not Global Warming but Global Burning! God help us us all, for our future generations. and children. Only wanted a BBQ at home...

Re: Big taboos? - D (28th Jul 2023 - 08:17:59) Sue, the first fifty of your young single male illegal immigrants arrive Tuesday. I'm sure you will want to receive them all and give them a warm welcome. I think you'll find the ages are from eighteen to sixty though, hope that's not a disappointment. Enjoy!

Re: Big taboos? - D (28th Jul 2023 - 12:02:14) There is criticism of the Conservative Party over ulez on this thread so I think it worth pointing out the current mayor is actually a member of the Labour Party.

Re: Big taboos? - gareth j rees (28th Jul 2023 - 15:33:44) no criticism of the Tories over ULEZ it's a poor labour mayor policy imo unfortunately there aren't enough characters on my keyboard to list all of the criticism of the tories you guys will find out soon enough tho #generalelectionnow

Re: Big taboos? - D (30th Jul 2023 - 01:18:16) Gareth, it was your Labour lot who messed up my pension. Reference is made on this thread about the government urging us to buy diesel vehicles for the environment. Labour again, Gordon Brown if I remember.

Re: Big taboos? - Anti ulez (30th Jul 2023 - 08:51:42) Ulez is a tax on the poor and work classes. The noise for cleaner air is constant but once again no tangible evidence of improvement of air quality from its supporters. I doubt the money will go towards respiratory research for Londoners. You only need to look on actual social media sites and it’s clear it’s a tax to bale out tfl which is near bankrupt.

Re: Big taboos? - D (30th Jul 2023 - 11:42:27) How much crap does aviation out in the air? One trip across the Atlantic must produce more than any car does in a year. We have to produce less so they can produce more.

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